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Old 11-10-08, 11:07 AM
Phillip
 
Posts: n/a
Default cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka

Mi dispiace che questo articolo e' in inglese, ma lo mando per chi
possa leggerlo. E' scritto da un francese straordinario che abita in
India, Francois Gautier. Lui parla degli assalti recenti di alcuni
gruppi indu' contra chiese cristiane nella mia provincia meridionale
di Karnataka. Ho menzionato io il problema dei missionari cristiani
in India.


--

François Gautier First Published : 06 Oct 2008

I was born in a Catholic family. My uncle was a priest, a wonderful
man of warmth and compassion and I spent most my early years in
Catholic boarding schools. When I was young I wanted to become a
missionary and to ‘convert’ pagans in Asia. What I was taught by
priests was that Hindus worship false gods and they needed to be
brought back to the True Word by Jesus Christ.


Then of course, I came to India and discovered that actually Hindus,
far from being the heathens, as had been portrayed in Europe, not only
believed God’s diversity, the wonderful concept of avatar, but had
given refuge to all persecuted minorities of the world, whether the
Syrian Christians, the Parsis, the Jews (India is the only country in
the world where Jews were not persecuted), the Armenians, or today the
Tibetans.

I am also aghast at the one-sided coverage by the Indian media of the
Christian- Hindu problem: blasts after blasts have killed hundreds of
innocent Hindus in Varanasi, Delhi, Mumbai train blasts, Jaipur, etc.
Yet, neither Manmohan Singh nor Sonia Gandhi have pronounced once the
word ‘Islamic terrorism.’ But when furious Hindus, tired of being made
fun of, of witnessing their brothers and sisters converted by
financials traps, of seeing a 84-year-old swami and his Mataji
brutally murdered, of reading blasphemy about their Gods, vent their
anger against churches, many of them makeshifts, the Indian government
goes after the soft target which the Hindus are. The same thing
applies to the United States: they never warned Muslim organisations
in India about the killing of Hindus, but when dollars are used to buy
new converts and it angers the majority community of India,Washington
has the arrogance to issue a warning, and Manmohan Singh does not have
the pride to tell the US to mind its own business.

Neither the Indian press nor the western correspondents bothered to
write about what made Hindus angry in Karnataka: Newlife, one
important westernfunded missionary centre ( http://www.newlifev
oice.org) , began making conversions in and around Mangalore by
accosting poor people in market areas, or in bus stands, befriending
them and then taking them to churches to introduce them to the father.

Upon introduction they were paid Rs 2,500 per person and then taken to
the Velankanni shrine, in Tamil Nadu, where they would get another Rs.
3,000.

When they finally converted to Christianity by changing the name, they
got an incentive of Rs 10,000 onwards.

Newlife would then give them instructions to abandon wearing tilak on
forehead, not to visit and offer prayers at the Hindu temples,
replacing the photos and idols of Hindu gods and goddesses with a
Cross, etc.

But what really angered local Hindus was when Newlife went one step
further and published a book in Kannada — Satya Darshini — which was
widely distributed by its missionaries. Here below is the translation
of some of the most abusive passages: “Urvashi — the daughter of Lord
Vishnu — is a prostitute.

Vashistha is the son of this prostitute.

He in turn married his own Mother. Such a degraded person is the Guru
of the Hindu God Rama. (page 48).

When Krishna himself is wallowing in darkness of hell, how can he
enlighten others? Since Krishna himself is a shady character, there is
a need for us to liberate his misled followers (page 50). It was
Brahma himself who kidnapped Sita.

“Since Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva were themselves victims of lust, it is
a sin to consider them as Gods. (page 39).

When the Trinity of Hinduism (Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva) are consumed
by lust and anger, how can they liberate others? The projection of
them as Gods is nothing but a joke. (page 39). God, please liberate
the sinful people of India who are worshipping False Gods. (Page 39).”
When blasphemy and much worse is brought against the most sacred Hindu
Gods, Hindus are supposed to take it meekly as sheep and let
themselves be converted to a foreign religion! There are more than
4,000 foreign Christian missionaries involved in conversion activities
across different states.

In Tripura, there were no Christians at the time of independence.
There are 1,20,000 today, a 90 per cent increase since 1991. The
figures are even more striking in Arunachal Pradesh, where there were
only 1,710 Christians in 1961, but 1.2 million today, as well as 780
churches! In Andhra Pradesh, churches are coming up every day in far-
flung villages and there was even an attempt to set up one near
Tirupati..

Christians throughout the ages have strived on the concept of
persecution and as a brought up Catholic, I remember feeling bad about
all those martyred saints of Christianity. Christians in India like to
say that they are only two per cent and can do no harm. But it is a
sham: in the Tamil Nadu coastal belt from Chennai to Kanyakumari,
there must be now 10 per cent Christians posttsunami and the same may
be true in other parts of south India.

My heart goes out to Karnataka Chief Minister BS Yeddyurappa who took
a courageous stand against unethical Christian conversions, but is now
under pressure from the Centre.

The BJP, having learnt from bitter experience that the Congress has no
qualm in invoking President’s rule under fallacious pretexts in states
which are ruled by non-Congress governments is in a quandary: it must
show some action against militant Hindu groups while remaining true to
itself.

This is why Yeddyurappa took some action against Hindu groups while
saying that his government will not tolerate forcible conversions and
will take stringent action against missionaries involved in
conversions.

And ultimately, the blame must fall on Hindus: they are 800 million in
India, the overwhelming majority; they have the brains, they have the
money and they have the power. But either their intellectual and
political class sides with the minorities, out of fear, inferiority
complex imbedded by the British or just sheer crass political
opportunism, or the bigger mass is indifferent inert, selfish, un-
civic conscious. Every Hindu is the inheritor of the only surviving
spiritual knowledge which at the moment is under a concerted attack by
Christian missionaries, Americanisation, Marxism and Islamic
fundamentalism.

fgautier@rediffmail .com
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Old 12-10-08, 07:19 AM
.Emc2
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka



"Phillip" <phillip.ernest@utoronto.ca> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:e92d1c1d-0be0-43f5-b143-3ef4c1122530@p10g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> Mi dispiace che questo articolo e' in inglese, ma lo mando per chi
> possa leggerlo. E' scritto da un francese straordinario che abita in
> India, Francois Gautier. Lui parla degli assalti recenti di alcuni
> gruppi indu' contra chiese cristiane nella mia provincia meridionale
> di Karnataka. Ho menzionato io il problema dei missionari cristiani
> in India.




e chi cazzo se ne frega?
i criminali missionari cristiani potevano restare a casa loro



>
> --
>
> François Gautier First Published : 06 Oct 2008
>
> I was born in a Catholic family. My uncle was a priest, a wonderful
> man of warmth and compassion and I spent most my early years in
> Catholic boarding schools. When I was young I wanted to become a
> missionary and to ‘convert’ pagans in Asia. What I was taught by
> priests was that Hindus worship false gods and they needed to be
> brought back to the True Word by Jesus Christ.
>
>
> Then of course, I came to India and discovered that actually Hindus,
> far from being the heathens, as had been portrayed in Europe, not only
> believed God’s diversity, the wonderful concept of avatar, but had
> given refuge to all persecuted minorities of the world, whether the
> Syrian Christians, the Parsis, the Jews (India is the only country in
> the world where Jews were not persecuted), the Armenians, or today the
> Tibetans.
>
> I am also aghast at the one-sided coverage by the Indian media of the
> Christian- Hindu problem: blasts after blasts have killed hundreds of
> innocent Hindus in Varanasi, Delhi, Mumbai train blasts, Jaipur, etc.
> Yet, neither Manmohan Singh nor Sonia Gandhi have pronounced once the
> word ‘Islamic terrorism.’ But when furious Hindus, tired of being made
> fun of, of witnessing their brothers and sisters converted by
> financials traps, of seeing a 84-year-old swami and his Mataji
> brutally murdered, of reading blasphemy about their Gods, vent their
> anger against churches, many of them makeshifts, the Indian government
> goes after the soft target which the Hindus are. The same thing
> applies to the United States: they never warned Muslim organisations
> in India about the killing of Hindus, but when dollars are used to buy
> new converts and it angers the majority community of India,Washington
> has the arrogance to issue a warning, and Manmohan Singh does not have
> the pride to tell the US to mind its own business.
>
> Neither the Indian press nor the western correspondents bothered to
> write about what made Hindus angry in Karnataka: Newlife, one
> important westernfunded missionary centre ( http://www.newlifev
> oice.org) , began making conversions in and around Mangalore by
> accosting poor people in market areas, or in bus stands, befriending
> them and then taking them to churches to introduce them to the father.
>
> Upon introduction they were paid Rs 2,500 per person and then taken to
> the Velankanni shrine, in Tamil Nadu, where they would get another Rs.
> 3,000.
>
> When they finally converted to Christianity by changing the name, they
> got an incentive of Rs 10,000 onwards.
>
> Newlife would then give them instructions to abandon wearing tilak on
> forehead, not to visit and offer prayers at the Hindu temples,
> replacing the photos and idols of Hindu gods and goddesses with a
> Cross, etc.
>
> But what really angered local Hindus was when Newlife went one step
> further and published a book in Kannada — Satya Darshini — which was
> widely distributed by its missionaries. Here below is the translation
> of some of the most abusive passages: “Urvashi — the daughter of Lord
> Vishnu — is a prostitute.
>
> Vashistha is the son of this prostitute.
>
> He in turn married his own Mother. Such a degraded person is the Guru
> of the Hindu God Rama. (page 48).
>
> When Krishna himself is wallowing in darkness of hell, how can he
> enlighten others? Since Krishna himself is a shady character, there is
> a need for us to liberate his misled followers (page 50). It was
> Brahma himself who kidnapped Sita.
>
> “Since Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva were themselves victims of lust, it is
> a sin to consider them as Gods. (page 39).
>
> When the Trinity of Hinduism (Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva) are consumed
> by lust and anger, how can they liberate others? The projection of
> them as Gods is nothing but a joke. (page 39). God, please liberate
> the sinful people of India who are worshipping False Gods. (Page 39).”
> When blasphemy and much worse is brought against the most sacred Hindu
> Gods, Hindus are supposed to take it meekly as sheep and let
> themselves be converted to a foreign religion! There are more than
> 4,000 foreign Christian missionaries involved in conversion activities
> across different states.
>
> In Tripura, there were no Christians at the time of independence.
> There are 1,20,000 today, a 90 per cent increase since 1991. The
> figures are even more striking in Arunachal Pradesh, where there were
> only 1,710 Christians in 1961, but 1.2 million today, as well as 780
> churches! In Andhra Pradesh, churches are coming up every day in far-
> flung villages and there was even an attempt to set up one near
> Tirupati..
>
> Christians throughout the ages have strived on the concept of
> persecution and as a brought up Catholic, I remember feeling bad about
> all those martyred saints of Christianity. Christians in India like to
> say that they are only two per cent and can do no harm. But it is a
> sham: in the Tamil Nadu coastal belt from Chennai to Kanyakumari,
> there must be now 10 per cent Christians posttsunami and the same may
> be true in other parts of south India.
>
> My heart goes out to Karnataka Chief Minister BS Yeddyurappa who took
> a courageous stand against unethical Christian conversions, but is now
> under pressure from the Centre.
>
> The BJP, having learnt from bitter experience that the Congress has no
> qualm in invoking President’s rule under fallacious pretexts in states
> which are ruled by non-Congress governments is in a quandary: it must
> show some action against militant Hindu groups while remaining true to
> itself.
>
> This is why Yeddyurappa took some action against Hindu groups while
> saying that his government will not tolerate forcible conversions and
> will take stringent action against missionaries involved in
> conversions.
>
> And ultimately, the blame must fall on Hindus: they are 800 million in
> India, the overwhelming majority; they have the brains, they have the
> money and they have the power. But either their intellectual and
> political class sides with the minorities, out of fear, inferiority
> complex imbedded by the British or just sheer crass political
> opportunism, or the bigger mass is indifferent inert, selfish, un-
> civic conscious. Every Hindu is the inheritor of the only surviving
> spiritual knowledge which at the moment is under a concerted attack by
> Christian missionaries, Americanisation, Marxism and Islamic
> fundamentalism.
>
> fgautier@rediffmail .com


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Old 12-10-08, 10:29 AM
RobDue
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka


".Emc2" <nontelodico.@ol.com> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:48f188fd$0$18147$4fafbaef@reader3.news.tin.it ...
>
> e chi cazzo se ne frega?
> i criminali missionari cristiani potevano restare a casa loro
>


Per .Emc2:
http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=kCscWlOiXd0

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Old 12-10-08, 11:32 AM
Alessandro Selli
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka

..Emc2 ha scritto:

[...]

> i criminali missionari cristiani potevano restare a casa loro


Fosse mai il problema che quei missionari cristiani che sono detti
criminali a casa loro /non/ sono rimasti, infatti?

Sono sicuro che la questione sia da vedersi sotto molti punti di
vista oltre a questo, ma visto che su questo ci si è soffermati, per ora
mi limito a tale banalità.

Ciao,

--
Alessandro Selli http://alessandro.route-add.net
AVVERTENZA: i messaggi inviati a "trappola" non mi arriveranno.
WARNING: messages sent to "trappola" will never reach me.
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Old 12-10-08, 12:34 PM
.Emc2
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka



"RobDue" <RobDue@gmail.com> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:gcsci5$uh8$1@tdi.cu.mi.it...
>
> ".Emc2" <nontelodico.@ol.com> ha scritto nel messaggio
> news:48f188fd$0$18147$4fafbaef@reader3.news.tin.it ...
>>
>> e chi cazzo se ne frega?
>> i criminali missionari cristiani potevano restare a casa loro
>>

>
> Per .Emc2:
> http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=kCscWlOiXd0



testa di cazzo, io quoto come voglio e ciò che voglio
e delle tue cagate non me ne frega meno di un cazzo



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Old 12-10-08, 12:39 PM
.Emc2
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka



"Alessandro Selli" <trappola@route-add.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:6ldsmtFbsudoU1@mid.individual.net...
> .Emc2 ha scritto:
>
> [...]
>
>> i criminali missionari cristiani potevano restare a casa loro

>
> Fosse mai il problema che quei missionari cristiani che sono detti
> criminali a casa loro /non/ sono rimasti, infatti?
>
> Sono sicuro che la questione sia da vedersi sotto molti punti di vista
> oltre a questo, ma visto che su questo ci si è soffermati, per ora mi
> limito a tale banalità.



rotfl
i missionari che vanno in giro per il mondo a distruggere
culture, tradizioni, miti, lingue e quant'altro per imporre
con la violenza il loro dio inventato è una banalità ?

complimenti

lei merita il permio nobel per l'ipocrisia e la disonestà

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Old 12-10-08, 02:17 PM
Alessandro Selli
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka

..Emc2 ha scritto:
>
> "Alessandro Selli" <trappola@route-add.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
> news:6ldsmtFbsudoU1@mid.individual.net...
>> .Emc2 ha scritto:
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>> i criminali missionari cristiani potevano restare a casa loro

>>
>> Fosse mai il problema che quei missionari cristiani che sono detti
>> criminali a casa loro /non/ sono rimasti, infatti?
>>
>> Sono sicuro che la questione sia da vedersi sotto molti punti di
>> vista oltre a questo, ma visto che su questo ci si è soffermati, per
>> ora mi limito a tale banalità.

>
> rotfl
> i missionari che vanno in giro per il mondo a distruggere
> culture, tradizioni, miti, lingue e quant'altro per imporre
> con la violenza il loro dio inventato è una banalità ?


La "banalità" era chiaramente diretta al commento espresso riguardo
ai fatti della discussione, non ai fatti stessi.

Come dire banale, a proposito di qualcuno che si sia rotto la testa
dacendo da una moto senza casco, che si fosse messo il casco, o meglio
ancora non fosse andato in moto, la testa non se la sarebbe rotta.

Il commento è banale, non la testa rotta.

Ciao,

--
Alessandro Selli http://alessandro.route-add.net
AVVERTENZA: i messaggi inviati a "trappola" non mi arriveranno.
WARNING: messages sent to "trappola" will never reach me.
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Old 12-10-08, 02:21 PM
Raffaele Benzi
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka


"Phillip" <phillip.ernest@utoronto.ca> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:e92d1c1d-0be0-43f5-b143-3ef4c1122530@p10g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
Mi dispiace che questo articolo e' in inglese, ma lo mando per chi
possa leggerlo. E' scritto da un francese straordinario che abita in
India, Francois Gautier. Lui parla degli assalti recenti di alcuni
gruppi indu' contra chiese cristiane nella mia provincia meridionale
di Karnataka. Ho menzionato io il problema dei missionari cristiani
in India.


--

Mi sono andato a rileggere qualche capitolo di " homo jerarchicus" saggio
in cui viene spiegata la struttura delle caste.
Il gerosso problema generato dall'intromissione dei missionari cattolici
nel mondo indiano e' proprio la cospirazione, realizzata all'interno delle
caste piu' basse e considerate " impure" , per l'abolizione del concetto
stesso di casta.

La manovra riusci' duemila anni fa, raccogliendo tra gli schiavi il nucleo
di carne da cannone necessario per la conquista del potere, permettendo di
sacrificare, nelle rare persecuzioni anticristiane, la bassa plebe, senza
toccare minimamente la classe dirigente, costituita da funzionari imperiali
( tutti sacerdoti mitraici, per default, credenti anche nel dio semita, ma
sempre funzionari imperiali, che con le persecuzioni, potevano solo
accrescere il loro occulto potere).

Il fatto che gli attivisti hindu abbiano aperto la caccia al cristiano,
vista la sua intenzione di distruggere dall'interno il sistema delle caste,
per conquistare una nicchia privilegiata di potere, non mi sembra un grosso
problema, sarebbe , magari, da sapere se sono accettati cacciatori
stranieri, e nel caso positivo, quali documenti siano necessari per
ottenere un porto d'armi valido ed una lettera di libera caccia.
Opterei per un tipo di abbattimento che non stressi eccessivamente la preda
prima della raccolta....;-))))

Se qualcuno si dovesse scandalizzare, vorrei ricordare che a Beirut, durante
la guerra ed a Sarajevo, durante l'assedio, era pratica comune il week end
di caccia da parte di cecchini europei , che a caro prezzo, erano scortati
ed assistiti sul posto, fino ad esaurimento delle munizioni o raccolta del
carniere prepagato....

Raffaele


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Old 13-10-08, 07:33 AM
.Emc2
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka



"Alessandro Selli" <trappola@route-add.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
news:6le6cvFc1bhqU1@mid.individual.net...
> .Emc2 ha scritto:
>>
>> "Alessandro Selli" <trappola@route-add.net> ha scritto nel messaggio
>> news:6ldsmtFbsudoU1@mid.individual.net...
>>> .Emc2 ha scritto:
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>>> i criminali missionari cristiani potevano restare a casa loro
>>>
>>> Fosse mai il problema che quei missionari cristiani che sono detti
>>> criminali a casa loro /non/ sono rimasti, infatti?
>>>
>>> Sono sicuro che la questione sia da vedersi sotto molti punti di vista
>>> oltre a questo, ma visto che su questo ci si è soffermati, per ora mi
>>> limito a tale banalità.

>>
>> rotfl
>> i missionari che vanno in giro per il mondo a distruggere
>> culture, tradizioni, miti, lingue e quant'altro per imporre
>> con la violenza il loro dio inventato è una banalità ?

>
> La "banalità" era chiaramente diretta al commento espresso riguardo ai
> fatti della discussione, non ai fatti stessi.
>
> Come dire banale, a proposito di qualcuno che si sia rotto la testa
> dacendo da una moto senza casco, che si fosse messo il casco, o meglio
> ancora non fosse andato in moto, la testa non se la sarebbe rotta.
>
> Il commento è banale, non la testa rotta.




Guardando le cose dal punto di vista dei catto-idioti
il commento è tutt'altro che banale perchè contiene una
accusa alquanto pesante che nessuno difende

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Old 13-10-08, 12:38 PM
Phillip
 
Posts: n/a
Default Re: cio' che ha incollerito gli indu' di Karnataka

On 12 Ott, 17:21, "Raffaele Benzi" <raffaelebe...@alice.it> wrote:

> Il fatto che gli attivisti hindu abbiano aperto la caccia al cristiano,
> vista la sua intenzione di distruggere dall'interno il sistema delle caste,
> per conquistare una nicchia privilegiata di potere, *non mi sembra un grosso
> problema, sarebbe , magari, da sapere se sono accettati cacciatori
> stranieri, *e nel caso positivo, quali documenti siano necessari per
> ottenere un porto d'armi valido ed una lettera di libera caccia.


Temo che sarebbe piu' facile ottenere una vidimazione di missionario,
ma potresti provare a ottenere una turistica, visto che vorresti
venirci solo per fare un po' di sport.


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